[e2e] Are we doing sliding window in the Internet?

Joe Touch touch at ISI.EDU
Thu Jan 4 11:35:16 PST 2007

Ian McDonald wrote:
> On 1/5/07, Joe Touch <touch at isi.edu> wrote:
> I'm sorry for the way I said things. I wasn't trying to start a
> mini-flame war but I have a habit of saying things in a way that
> causes misunderstanding at times.
>> > You'll find that Linux is probably the most RFC compliant
>> > implementation of TCP.
>> Should we include the time when Linux defaulted T/TCP to "on" in that?
>> Or the default-ON of ABC? I.e., there are certainly points when versions
>> of Linux were clearly not RFC-compliant in more significant ways; which
>> version are you referring to?
> What I was meaning is that Linux at present seems to be attracting
> people to check code against RFCs and implement experimental RFCs.
> This is probably because Linux is "fashionable" at the moment.

I think it's also a property of Linux, as you note below. One of its
major benefits its that many devices/features/protocols are probably
implemented and available; that's also one of its detriments at times,

>...Linux developers are very much in the mold of
> "lets try this out and see what happens".


>> > Linux is a meritocracy so if
>> > people from this list were to go over to the netdev mailing list and
>> > make a reasonable argument then it will get listened to.
>> That's the disconnect here. *THE* place for this sort of discussion is
>> the IETF, which this list is a peripheral (IRTF) party to. Perhaps the
>> discussion should occur on TSVWG, or even TCPM. But expecting us to take
>> this to the Linux community is a disconnect on how standards bodies work.
> But surely if you say Linux is broken and then you don't inform the
> relevant developers then how will it get fixed? Its nice to moan about
> a broken TCP implementation but if you talk about that within your own
> community it doesn't get fixed.

We're not talking about that in "our own community" on this list; this
(IRTF) list, as with IETF lists, is for all communities to come together
to discuss such issues.

> I'm referring specifically to the situations where people are saying
> Linux is not following the RFCs. The rest of the discussion quite
> rightly does belong here.

I agree that the discussion of how to fix this in Linux belongs on a
Linux list, but we're all hoping they track this and other IETF lists
and take that information there.

> I encourage people to post comments to relevant Linux people if they
> are concerned.

It'd be great for those on this list who either use Linux or who are
interested to participate on the Linux lists too, but I'm sincerely
hoping the Linux folk aren't waiting around for us to post this issue to
their lists to address it.


Joe Touch
Sr. Network Engineer, USAF TSAT Space Segment

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